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tv   House Oversight Committee Meets to Consider Its Rules  CSPAN  January 31, 2023 11:00pm-12:53am EST

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books including soon-to-be published the noise of typewriters. then at 10:00 p.m. eastern on after words committee organizers author of t great escape retells the story help men from india entered into the u.s. as guest workers only to become trapped and forced labor. he is interviewed by migration policy institute watch book tv every sunday on cspan2 and find a full schedule on your program guide or watch online anytime at ♪ c-span is your unfiltered view of government that were funded by these television companies and more including comcast. >> doing this is just a committee center? no it's my more than that. comcast is parting with 1000 committee centers to get wi-fi enabled the students from
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low-income families get the tools they need to be ready for anything. coast support c-span is a public service along these other television providers giving you a front row seat to democracy. the house oversight and accountability committee has adopted a new package for the 118th congress by a partyline vote of 25 -- 19. the new roles include putting into virtual participation and public hearings for members and witnesses. and the creation of five new subcommittees. this runs about an hour and 50 minutes. minutes. [background noises] [background noises]
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[inaudible conversations] without objection the chair man is authorized to declare recess at any time. i want to welcome everyone to the meeting of the committee on oversight and accountability. the committee i believe will be theta most exciting and effectie committee for this congress. we are going to be returning the committee to its core mission and that is to ensure taxpayer
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dollars are not being mismanaged, abused or wasted. to shine w a light and make sure the federal government is working efficientlyer for the american people. for this meeting we will be proceedinge as follows. first ranking member raskin's and i will introduce new members then we will officially adopt the committee rules. i want to welcome all of our returning members. it's great to have you with this congress and i also want to welcome back to the committee chair man mike turner from ohio, congressman gary palmer from alabama, congressman kelly armstrong from north dakota and the congressman from arizona. last i want to welcome the new members to the committee from all parts of the great country. firstm of all we will go in over seniority i want to recognize
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scott. from pennsylvania. welcome. william timmons from. south orcarolina. marjorie taylor green from georgia. lisa mclean from michigan, ryan from colorado, russell fry from south carolina. anna luna from florida. chuck edwards from north carolina. nick lane worthy from new york and eric pearlson from new jersey. welcome too the oversight committee which again i think you will find is the best committee in congress. we are really glad you are on the committee and look forward to working with each of you. we have a big agenda and we are just going to work hard to be effective for the taxpayers and the american people. with that i yielded to the distinguished gentleman, the ranking member to introduce
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members but first i want to publicly say we are all rooting for you and we know that you are going to win this battle. you'reht in our thoughts and prayers and i yielded to ranking member raskin. >> thank you very much it means a lot to me. i'm gratified to receive so many kind words of encouragement and sympathy from colleagues on both sides of the aisle and i hope that these expressions lead to friendship over the yearr and i plan on getting through this thing and thank you for your patience and indulgence. [applause] p now it's my turn to welcome our members on our side of the aisle beginning with eleanor holmes norton who represents the district in columbia. mr. lynch of massachusetts,
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connolly of virginia mr. con of ms. aoc who is the ranking member for the congress, ms. porter of california, ms. bush, ms. brown and mr. gomez those are the returning members. across the country the new members are melanie stansberry of new mexico, robert garcia of california, maxwell from florida, summarily from pennsylvania, dan goldman from new york and sharon moskowitz. it's hard for me not today to think about my fellow maryland are elijah cummings who is
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chairman and ranking member of the committee not sohi long ago elijah recruited me to oversight and taught me the central purpose of the committee ourf jb is not as an opportunity or a violator of g the rights but rather as the protector of the rights and liberties and to be effective and efficient instrument of the common good and i take the duty seriously and i'm committed to ensuring with you and effective and efficient government that delivers meaningful benefits to the people that we serve and i've taken the liberty of purchasing out of my own pocket i hasten to add a copy of common sense for every member of the committee, republican, democrat, the pamphlet that launched the revolution because what we need
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to proceeding to succeed in the committee is common sense to use the senses and the reason to make sure we are vindicating the public interests the constitution exists that will be coming to everybody's office this week and we pledge to work closely with you in the days ahead whenever we can find grounds for f bipartisan work ad ancollaboration we will pursue t and obviously standing up for the constitution for the bill of rights and a process of collaboration and optimistic we will be able to find a good constructive path forward thank you for working with us i hope we will be able to work successfully together over the next several years.nk >> we will move to consider the
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rules substantially the same as last congress with only a few changes and first of the new subcommittee and they are just jurisdictions through the subcommittees we will once again focus on the priorities of the american people. second we include a change to allow members to participate in the subcommittee and select committee hearings at the discretion of the chair. with house rules we made clear a witness can only bring to personal nongovernmental attorneys to the deposition to advise them to their rights and before i yielded to the ranking member i want to thank the staff for providing feedback to the rules i know we have lots of communication back and forth and we do not come to an agreement on the suggested edits but i know we will be able to file.
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with that i yield back for his opening statement on the rules. thank you mr. chairman and i have an amendment at the desk. while the clerk prepares, i will just say thank you for working with us on the rules. most of it we were able to go along with it but we definitely have a few issues we want to raise today and i'm hoping we might be able to work them out and that is the source of the first amendment.
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amendment number one on oversight and accountability as offered by representative raskin. thank youu congressman. to strike the provision of rule seven granting the chair the unilateral discussion to allow committee members to participate in the hearings of the subcommittees on which they are not members. this has been a practice on the committee but such has historically been granted through unanimous consent requests on both sides and this is a practice that allows members to enjoy great flexibility and accountability to each other. i'm certain members on both sides of the oil will not recall a single communication when anyone has ever objected to waving someoneo along so the practice has worked seamlessly in a bipartisan way for decades and there is no need to break it into centralized b authorities n
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the chair. the danger of course whether it's democrat or republican will be used to allow certain members so we prefer to stick with the unanimous consent practice. this moves to strike that one part. >> would the distinguished ranking member yield? >> i want to join him in supporting this amendment. i've been in the committee this is now my tenth year. republican chairs, democratic chairs, republican majorities, democratic majorities and we've never had a problem unanimously waving somebody on to seek to participate and i need to know the rationale would be for changingis that procedure.
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it would be a good action on the part ofoo all of us, so i urge adoption on this modification of the rules and i think my friend for yielding. >> mr. chairman it looks like there might be other members who want too weigh in. >> okay i i will yield back. we can go back and forth. >> the house rules require a vote that meets unanimous consent to allow this. this rule change memorializes what's already the case. so itdy can still be used. there's nothing changed. this just speeds things up with some of these committee hearings. we don't have to do that to disrupts the flow. i'm bound by house rules and pledge to follow. i urge myul colleagues to vote o on the amendment and do any members have any further
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discussion? >> this is merely a courtesy so i support the ranking members change as a courtesy any member could. i yield back. >> do any other members seek recognition? >> the chair recognizes mr. lynch. >> i don't want to repeat what my colleagues have said but in the past, and i've been on the committee this is now my 22nd year. we've always had in agreement. with the competing activity is going on in other hearings, it's often challenging to get members
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to commend because they've got commitments and others. making the process fluid and generous and bipartisan it would be good if not for one party or the other but the work we are about to embark on. the question is on the amendment. those in favor, aye. this is the same way we did this last year. i will get this down after about the third vote here.
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>> amendment number two as offered by representative lynch. >> in the interest of fairness and efficiency of the amendmentt would simply afford the ranking members and the gentleman from maryland the same description the proposed committee rules granted and other proceedings in support of this amendment i would underscore that granting our chair man the unilateral authority to determine whether the committee member may participate in an oversight committee hearing or additional oversight activities does not align with previous committee practices while precedent during
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my time on the committee as the previous training and ranking member on national security for at least the past eight years i can attest the subcommittee rules and have not graded of the chair such authority under either democratic or republican majority. in stark contrast we primarily left the questiones of the membr participation to the colleagues through bipartisan unanimous consent requests to waive interest onto the subcommittee for hearings which has never been denied. whether the republican member ordemocratic member wanted to ce in and the oversight committee has unlimited jurisdictions often times we have members who are on other jurisdictional committees that share our interest. the proposed rule regarding the itmember participation also contravenes the fundamental mission to conduct oversight to identify waste, fraud, abuse and hold the government accountable.
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and also in favor of reform on behalf of the american people. as recommended by the nonpartisan project on project n government oversight, congressional oversight is stronger and more credible when it is bipartisan. rather than fostering a bipartisan examination of the issues facing the american people, and they are considerable, thishe encourages the partisan selection of which members can be afforded the opportunity to want to take congressional oversight at all. the amendment under consideration of what at least ensures that the oversight efforts do not full victim to the partisanship or the capriciousness whenor it comes o member participation. i urge my colleagues on both sides of the aisle to support this amendment and yield back the balance of my time. >> here the ranking member is asking for more consideration that is contemplative therefore the committeeon rules within the democratic members can still be considered andbe added to any
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hearing ated the discretion of e chair upon u a request for unanimous consent at any hearing. so, nothing changes. i urge my colleagues to vote no on this amendment. other members seeking recognition? mr. raskin. >> thank you very much. the only problem with the statement you made as it does create a change in introducing asymmetryng into the rules, and again members should consider this from the perspective of being in the majority now and potentially being in the minority leader because it is an asymmetrical rule that is adopted fact seems to benefit one team and at one point it will come to disadvantage you in the future. in the past because we had a universal unanimous consent practice, no one has had enough incentive to object and everybody understands that that should be a privilege of omembership in the committee tt you should be able to go to various subcommittees. if we centralized the power exclusively whether it's c republican or democrat that person will be able to grant it
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as a matter of course to members of his or her own party but deny to others or use unanimous consent to have somebody block it in that case. the rules work best when they work symmetrically and fairly for everyone so i would like very much the approach that mr. lynch has taken given we seem to be going down this road and the chair has the power to unilaterally grant a member participation in the preceding proceedingthe ranking member she the same power regardless of whether red or blue is a majorityhe or minority. >> the ranking member yields back. again i pledge to work with the ranking member on whomever he deems necessary. it doesn't change anything. any further members seek recognition? the question is on the amendment. all those
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in favor, aye. all those opposed, though. in the opinion of the chair, the noes have it. are there any more amendments at the table? >> the chair recognizes the ranking member. >> one another amendment. thank you this will allow remote participation -- >> i'm sorry the clerk will designate the appointment. the clerk will designate. >> amendment number three to the rules of the committee on oversight and accountability as offered by representative raskin. >> the chair recognizes the ranking member. >> this amendment will simply allow the remote participation in committee activities for members when in person participation would potentially
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compromise the member's health. that shouldn't prevent members that need reasonable accommodationsns in light of extremely exceptional medical circumstances from participating in committee proceedings for an of someone has covid-19. i appreciate the willingness that the chair man has displayed to regard members with health conditions to participate. i think it's important that we enshrine any exceptions in the rules and i want all of the members to be able to participate fully in the committee. no one should be prevented from doing their duties on behalf of their constituents due to unavoidable and uncontrollable health conditions whether it is beinghe immunocompromised. i submit the amendment. >> as the chairman already has theu discretion to make
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reasonable accommodations in the situation as the ranking member just mentioned. he and i have had several conversations and i will say this i will do everything in my ability to work with you to make suree we can accommodate anythig while you're undergoing treatment. i'm very sympathetic too what you're going through. we have members on our side. my mother went through this and we will work with you. i give you that pledge. for example we made in an accommodation at this interview to enable the ranking member to appear remotely. i pledge to continue working with the ranking member as already asked we demonstrate that in good faith with the transcribed interview later on today. i urge my colleagues to vote no. does any other member seek recognition? the chair recognizes.
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>> i appreciate the accommodation both to the ranking member in his pledge to work legitimate. the rule is the architecture for the next two years and we need a rule that assures should to somebody else be in that chair. iri think the amendment isn't unnecessary and that improves things. over 1.5 million people have diedop from this terrible virus. people have immune compromised systems because of this virus
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not just a nice thing to do if somebody asks for it. it's the essential thing to do both from members and witnesses as we proceed in the committee. i think it is going to be essential but we don't know that yet. we've had many rounds and a variance of the virus. i urge the adoption of the change and urge we all food on the witnesses and i think the chair man for giving me time and thank the ranking member. i know the chair seems to agree with the purpose of the amendment. i think the amendment is necessary because the congress is so closely divided. because of the position we don't know whether for partisan
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purposes there would be a disagreement. it would be important for both sides. i yelled back. >> i opposed the amendment to the rules for the ranking member and the chair's desire to help asha we move to the congress but let's be very clear as a member of the committee in the last congress there were many members frankly who abused the virtual nature of the hearings. they would be in their offices during thesese hearings and not here in this room. attendance is necessary, so i would urge my members into my colleagues to vote down on this amendment understanding fully
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the issues the ranking member is dealing with. i would back the chair man on this. one of the things we all want to acknowledge is the gratitude for willingness to be able to work to accommodate. but to say this rule is not about him andhi is about the vat majority who encounter disabilities at some point in their life or another. the rules here are about the workplace and this is in place that it's not up to one individual discretion.
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a rule to protect based on the space outcome should be part of the workplace protection. i think the examples we said here are an example for the country. i extend quite a bit of understanding towards the representatives from florida about making sure but here in the states about the extraordinary extenuating healthcare related to circumstance so in that spirit i hope we would be able to set the example inl protecting the millions of people who encounter disabilities and immunocompromised conditions et cetera. for all of us in the rules of the committee and i yield back. >> the chair recognizes ms. marjorie taylor graham. >> thank you mr. chair i opposed
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the amendment. i think it's important for us to all recognized that the white fhouse just announced they will be calling into the covid-19 emergency. e there's no need for us to vote to amend the rules to allow for this. of course we extend our heartfelt prayers and good well wishes to mr. raskin as he's going through cancer treatment something certainly all of us can understand and hope the best for him. as far as pregnancy, pregnancy is a wonderful gift for women and becoming a mother is a wonderful thing. it doesn't stop many women from showing up for work so i don't think that should be considered a concern of why we need to adopt this amendment that members can show up. i think it's important to all members to come and be present as much as they possibly can because we have a job to do for
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the americano people and i yelld back. >> is there any further discussion? the chair pledges to work with any member on the various circumstances that's beenn the rule that will continue to be the rule. the question is on the amendment. again i urge my colleagues to vote no. all those in favor.
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all those opposed, no. in the opinion of the chair, the noesni have it. roll call votes will be postponed and at the time will be announced. it does any member seek recognition? >> i have an amendment at the desk. >> the clerk will designate the amendment. >> amendment number four. amendment number four on accountability as offered by the representative. >> the chair recognizes you for five minutes.
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>> thank you. mr. chair man. i want to first to say congratulations to the ranking member for his continued leadership and dedication to the committee and i want to congratulate you as well it's been great working with you in the previous congress and i congratulate you also on your position. i moved to offer amendment number four to the rules of the committee on oversight and accountability. house rule 11 caused the house committees and subcommittees to issue subpoenas for attendance and witnesses and the production of documents. this amendment will require a majority vote m of approval by members of the committee prior to authorizing and issuing a subpoenaui in the conduct of any investigation within the jurisdiction of the committee. i think we have a real opportunityal today to execute
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strong bipartisan oversight and this is a rule quite frankly both democrats and republicans supported. i am particularly pleased that you supported this amendment. i hope we embrace this moment so we can show quite frankly the american people and members of congress we are still prepared in the committee regardless so from both sides of the aisle to support the amendment i think you and yield back any time i may have remaining. >> the congressional subpoena is a tool that should be used in limited circumstances. it's used as appropriate when it attempts to reach an accommodation or at an impasse and necessary to obtain sensitive information such as
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financial information orce whena friendly subpoena is needed to protect a witness. in the normal course of committee business i hope to work with the ranking member on proposed subpoenas in advance. the american people have made clear they want the committee to conduct a fair and rigorous oversight and we will do that. that will require the committee to work quickly and efficiently and at times provide less opportunities and markups to uncover the truths in the time latest fashion. i appreciate you pointing out that i supported this amendment last congress but you alll opposed it. we want to keep the rules the way you had them in the last congress with respect to things change.
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if we need to provide that for anyy fact-finding as former chairwoman maloney pointed out, hundreds have been issued under both republican and democratic control without any vote. democrats provided no valid reason today we get to quote each other from the prior congress and then you did say it is a powerful tool.
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absolutely correct. the majority didn't accept that but i will say if we are going to be on a race to the bottom the president was said by the trump administration when he said he wouldn't cooperate with any subpoena at all and shut down the process and ignored and rejected 100 of the congressional subpoenas and i don't think we want to go down that route or encourage the biden administration to go down that route so i would encourage a complete reset at this point. let's t resolve to do better together and issue subpoenas together and make them stick and work. i urge all my colleagues to support thes amendment and i yield back. >> the issue of subpoenas in the
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committee have a long and sorry history. when the chair of the committee issued hundreds of subpoenas losing track of who he'd subpoenaed as a matter of fact, a mockery of the process. when tom davis my predecessor and henry waxman kind of switched back and forth as the chairman and ranking member, they actually send a model where they genuinely did consult each other in the chart to cooperate. why is that important? because from the institutional point of view if we simply proliferatee to the world with subpoenas, we are going to dilute the importance of that as a tool as you correctly pointed out it is c a tool i will be usg sparingly. i happen to believe that the congress ought to revise as a separate but coequal legislative
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branch and government. that's a fight someday we will revisit but we want to make sure i think all of us as members of the committee that the subpoena has force and meaning, that he athas broad support behind it ad i hope as we move forward that is a bird and we look at and issue subpoenas. for the sake of the institution, for the sake of the integrity of this committee i think the chair and ranking member and yield back. >> the chair recognizes mr. sessions. >> thank you. mr. chairman, i do understand that the debate that's going on back and forth. we've got a load of members that are seemingly brand-new. back in 97 and 98 when i sat on this committee, the gentle man, the chair man's burden was charged and was forced in having
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several hundred subpoenas. as a matter of fact i remember i was in particular a part of. to infiltrate our national security, a man who did come in and compromise the clinton administration and who compromised companies and to use political contributions and not just to get in the white house but to have the commerce department to allow the export of imported items of national security that dealt directly with rockets and their ability to work off a gyroscope and it was one of the biggest political
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important things he did. the attorney general of the united states chose not to answer questions when almost everybody in the department including the attorney from san diego who was bringing forth the case and she used her political power to stop those things. national security, things dealing with not just this committee but the entire country, so he was forced to issue these. three times the attorney general of the united states went into the hospital for exhaustion rather than coming to be a part of what this committee was asking for so i am aware of the games that get played into the things thated are hidden behind executive privilege and other things. i would like to see us opposed to that now that she was on the other foot to encourage the administration to be forthright as we ask things because this
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committee and other committees have gained knowledge about how to use the power of not just this committee, but of congress against donald trump and if you don't think those things are not going to be expected when the shoe is on the other foot, we've lost it. so i think that the ranking member and others on your side should use this as a commonality but it means you have to be forthrightht in the administratn which is an oath of office that he took so it's not lay down your sword and leave yourself defenseless. i appreciate the gentle man giving me time to express my views. >> the chair recognizes the gentleman from pennsylvania mr. perry. >> thank you mr. chairman and i just want to observe now that
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republicans are in the lead it's not lost on me that suddenly it's become a race to the bottom. don't you find that fascinating. i yield back. >> before we call for a vote, if i made, i am excited about this new found willingness to work with republicans. i think we will have some opportunities to work together in the future on the subpoenas. >> thank you and i congratulate you on your chairmanship. we've worked together if you are in our prayers. having been on this committee previously and now returning i think many of us who've been on the committee before have been through the process where we issue subpoenas and also evidence preservation orders
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particularly involving the obama administrators in cases where the subpoena power is not honored i have full confidence that you will only issue subpoenas judiciously and with full confidence that you and your staff will not lose track of any but in the case we do issue subpoenas were cases where we issue evidence-based preservation orders which i think could likely be the case in the committee i think we might need an additional tool to ensure the subpoenas and the evidence preservation orders are complied with and that we do the due diligence of the committee
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is required to do in the sum of the investigations we will most undoubtedly have to engage in over the next couple of years and with that i will yield back. >> thank you very much mr. chair. just a few other words in support of my amendment. i've heard representative burgess' name mentioned a couple of times and let me just say this about you. he and i felt like hell on a number of issues all through the 80s and halfway through the '90s. but we tried to find where we could commonality on things that didn't push us and push the congress in the wrong direction. we got in one argument with president reagan who said can i take you out w and buy you an ie cream cone and get you to agree.
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we have strong differences, very strong differences of opinion. but at the v end of the day, i thought where you could make a commonsense argument you could win over his support and he thought where he could make common sense he could win over mina so when i look up at the portrait of elijah cummings i am reminded he always said we can do better. you are absolutely right about the last congress. you voted to have this sort of amendment in place and the majority ruled in that instance but this provides the fresh opportunity not to turn left or right but to go ahead together as a committee recognizing two
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years from now we might be back in the same position on the other side making the argument for this amendment. for that whenort it comes to subpoena witnesses and documents that there ought to bets at least where we can provide it a semblance of unity and bipartisanship so the democrats and republicans are in fact agreeing on those subpoenas. i would ask people to just keep that in the back of your mind so when we use the term reset i think that is the perfect word for the situation. we can reset the clock and start moving in the right direction or continuing the path we are going which as both the ranking member into the chair man said he back and forth sort of seesaw. i yield back.
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>> i amm fascinated on this desire for a recess having wandered through these holes for someme period of time what the rule is without the amendment is nots dissimilar from what we see in the judiciary chair and that happens and we have been contendedr with that. weon live with that and know how it works and quite frankly we know how it works in here because that's what my friends across the aisle have engaged in for the last four years. this is nothing unusual. the notion that this is going to provide unity if we adopt this amendment is almost laughable on its face. that it will provide a russian
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reset moment is also laughable. the reality is we have disparity. we view the world differently. where we can find accommodation we should andou we will, but there's nothing unique, bizarre or out of the order on the current underlining rule that we are going to be voting on. so to say that we must have this freshness, this reset into basically saying now that you have control we don't want you to treat us the way you've treated us. you don't want to be treated the way you've been treating us and you're saying please have mercy
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and the reality for me is it may have been moved forward to the left to swing back and ultimately it will find an equilibrium will come as we flyd points of accommodation that we agree on going forward. but this amendment doesn't begin to do what i think you're telling me it's going to do so i would irredeemably oppose it. >> i've already yielded back but i wouldac be happy to yield to you. >> i am not saying please, please have mercy. [laughter] i'm a fighter that's not what i'm saying. i'm saying let's try to correct a wrong. >> that's fair enough. thank you and i appreciate that. i think everybody on the committee's fighters. that's why we arery on the committee and part of the reason
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we are fighting for what we truly believe is the best in the country. thank you and i will yield back. the chair recognizes the gentle lady from georgia. >> i appreciate the bipartisanship and iti think tht is what is missing in congress but i would alsoois like to remd the committee that after two years of a very heavily controlled hand in congress and on hearings where republicans didn't have a voice i in particular had no voice with committees being stripped of them by the former speaker and democrats in congress.r it's also important to point out that as far as subpoenas are concerned and how his family has been treated, eric trump has been subpoenaed over 400 times and has never broken a law.
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i think subpoena power is extremely important. the democrats have proven what they do with subpoena power especially with the january 6th committee and i think we can trust republicans on the committee and our new chair man to do a great job with it. i yield back. >> the question is on the amendment. all those in favor? opposed, no. in the opinion of the chair, noes have it. roll call votes will be postponed and the time will be announced in advance. >> i have an amendment at the desk. >> the clerk will designate the amendment. amendment number five to the
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rules of the committee of oversight and accountability is offered by the representative porter. >> the chair recognizes representative porter. >> thank you mr. chair. ii moved to offer this amendment so that the subcommittee rules are consistent with the house rules we w just enacted. this would set forth a simple clear process for the chair to determine when it's appropriate and if it's appropriate for a nongovernmental witness to appear remotely. before he served in congress i was a witness before congress many times and it is difficult for people of regular means, people in rural areas and from tribal communities to be able to travel here to washington often on very short notice and always at their personal expense. i think the committee room and halls of congress need to be filled with the voices of regular americans.
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experiencing the very challenges we are trying to do oversight of. this shouldn't be a committee room where the voices of lobbyists again and again are heard and heard loudly. i think this is an important rule to allow everyday americans from modest means and rural areas from indigenous areas ipeople with areas who can't ctravel when the chair determis it's appropriate to allow us to appear remotely and this is with of the republican rules practice that was just enacted setting for the procedure so the chair in his discretion may exercise that authority clearly. to seek permission to appear remotely. the house rules to provide the instructions for this accommodation so i don't believe my friends on the other side of
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the aisle have demonstrated why this amendment is necessary. i urge my colleagues to vote against it. >> ranking member raskin. >> i would hope this would be a commonsense amendment adopted and completely consistent with and following through on the rules inf the house itself. the amendment ensures the public is not robbed of a sensual testimony from people across the country. often times we talk about wanting the voices of america to be heard here. this is precisely the way to do it it provides equal access to the right to testify in ensuring the witnesses are not barred from participation. it's common sense and i hope you will in dorset.
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again i called to the attention of the committee the congress is evenly divided so it will make a difference that such a member be able too vote remotely and i strongly support this amendment. >> mr. chair. >> the chair recognizes ms. porter. >> the amendment does not permit voting remotely. the amendment at the desk is to allow nongovernmental witnesses would have toha otherwise travel to the committee on short notice all the chairs discretion to appear remotely so it is about lifting up the voice of the full swap of people. >> if you have a witness that demonstrates they don't have the
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financial means to appear in person then we will work with them anyway we can to accommodate and take that on a case-by-case basis. i don't think this amendment is necessary. any other member seeking recognition? >> all those in favor? all those opposed, though. in the opinion of the chair, the noes have it. any other members seek recognition? >> recorded vote has been requested. roll call votes will be postponed and the time will be announced in advance. >> mr. chair man i have an amendment of the desk. >> the clerk will designate the amendment. >> to the rules on oversight and accountability as offered by the representative crockett a vital
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part of the committee's work for althe past four years in light f the tragedy of the past weekend, passage of the amendment and the restoration of the civil rights subcommittee would show the american people with the committee stands for. whether we will waste taxpayers time and money on fishing expeditions or whether we will dedicate ourselves to holding those who violate the civil and human rights of our constituents accountable. under the current rules package if one constituent has a civil rights violated were civil liberties it offers no place for them to turn. it sends a message that the civil rights and t liberties are no longer a priority in the 118th congress as they've been in the past sessions of congress. i know that each of us regardless of the political background believes in the importance of civil rights and liberty so why would we turn a
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blind eye especially in a time like this when across i the natn from small towns to big cities americans are crying out against the interest perpetrated against tyre nichols. must do something about it.mi our congress has a legacy conducting history making investigations that rally the nation to the most humane resolution. in 1871, less than two years after the passage of the amendment guaranteeing the right to vote regardless of race, the ku klux klan used terrorism to even infringe on the right to vote and unlike leader times where members of the kkk were vigilantes in the 70s, local officials of all stripes took part in this organization. in the face of this a brazen attack on american civil rights, the congress rolled u up its
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sleeves and conducted real investigative oversight producing after a ten month investigation, 13 pages of reports. the findings of that investigation were a cornerstone after the landmark civil rights act of 75. as the committee charged with oversight and accountability, this is the legacy we inherit and we owe it to the american people to livecy up to it. when over 100 people every year are losing their lives and routine traffic stops, went over a dozen large police department's are operating under consent decrees for violation of their citizens civil liberties and when the attention of the nation is focused on the issue of civil rights, it is our duty to rise to the occasion and conduct oversight and provide accountability on this crucial subject and not move from this responsibility but without this amendment, that is what the passage of the current rules would do.
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one might argue accepting the argument only gives more reason onfor concern they comprise comprise themselves with only one of which could be construed to be used to investigate the circumstances. it's one of over a dozen charges when upholding american civil rights and liberties should be oneee of the core functions of e committee. it is a question of values, a question of legacy, a question of justice. let us live up to the legacy of the committee and to show the american people that we hear them and we are fighting for them and restore the subcommittee on civil rights and civill remedies. i urge passage and with that i will yield back. >> let me be very clear any topic that's not mentioned in theub jurisdiction is reserved r
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the full committee so we can have a committee hearing in this committee on basically anything we want. i know there's a lot of new members on the committee so i want to go back in history a little bit. i had a lot of respect and i think even the members on the other side of the aisle that were on the committee last year would agree we had a very good working relationship. now we work together several members on bipartisan legislation despite what the media says, there's a lot of bipartisan work that takes place in the committee and there could be a lot more. last year chair maloney and i and mr. lynch worked together to pass what i think was the most significant bipartisan bill last year inl congress, the postal reform bill and we will have the postmaster general before the committee soon to give an update on how that's going and what
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other improvements need to be made moving forward for the legislature and jurisdiction over here. chairwoman mace worked together on a lot of security bills. i worked and former ranking member worked with mr. conley on many good government bills to come out of this committee so there were some in this committee. i requested several that would have been and should have been bipartisan and i want to go through these. we were very interested and concerned about how some of the funds were being spent. but we never had a committee hearing like we are going to have tomorrow to examine. i know the select committee which is c a different committee
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have some hearings on that but we've never had a single hearing on that. we were concerned about the origination between this committee and at the select committee i hope that we are closer and i'm confident we will be because i wasn't on the select committee last year, the commission i think we will be working a lot closer with that subcommittee next year. i requested a hearing to look at the cbd oil. we are all over the board on this. there are people that support cbd oil and people that oppose it on both sides ofth the aisle. the most baffling to me that we will definitely have soon in the
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committee we wanted a bipartisan hearing on the pharmacy benefit managers. we havehe several hearings on te prescription drug pricing but we never touched on the things that i think is an area if there are hearings my friends on theng otr side off the aisle are interestd in having that would have bipartisan support, i'm very open to that. we are going to meet a a lot in the committee so you're going to have to work hard to be on the committee. we will have an active subcommittee process. any topic not mentioned in the names of the jurisdiction is
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reserved so i don't believe the amendment is necessary and i urge my colleagues to vote against it. does any other member seek recognition? >> thank you for that expression of openness. i very much appreciate that a sensibility that you've brought to thehe job and i'm glad that e are going to begin on covid-19 relief that have taken place under the program and certainly some things that we pursue very aggressively in the select committee. i'm delighted that the committee will take itit up and having sad that i do want to strongly support the amendment. the gentle lady from texas who herself is a civil rights and
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constitutional lawyer raises the important point that we had the subcommittee that seems to have vanished. i feel the obligation which i was the first and i guess the only chair up to this point that got to serve and we did a terrific bipartisan work of the subcommittee on the civil rights and civil liberties but there is an important point that makes this far more than a semantic issue being raised by the gentle lady from texas. mr. cummings was always adamant that there were two major purposes for the committee and one is to make sure that the laws and programs congress adopts go to the people they are intended for and are not siphoned off and wasted self
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enrichment andne corruption and other forms of fraud and abuse. the other purpose is to make sure the government is always respecting the rights and the freedoms and the civil liberties of the people. we were able to look at things that brought us together including certain kinds of abuses in the war on drugs, treatment for marijuana, governmental seizures and forfeitures that violated the civil liberties of the people. we looked at extremist political violence led by an dangerous groups in the country even before the explosion of violence that overcame congress in the capital january 6, 2021.
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i strongly support the gentle ladies amendment and yield back. >> i do agree about tyre nichols death i watched the video and it was tragic and difficult to watch and i would also like to point out that the city of democrats control and the five officers that have been arrested and charged i think that this isn't an issue of racism or anything like that. i think that the judge into the jury and the trial need to work out what happened but i share that with you and i would also like to point out something i hope you share with me. there's a woman in this room whose daughter was murdered january 6th, ashley babbitt. there's never been a trial as a matter of fact no one has cared about the person that shot and killed her and no one in this
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congress has really addressed that issue. january 6th committee didn't address it and i believe that there are many people that came into the capital january 6th whose civil rights and liberties are being violated heavily and this committee will look into those civil rights abuses because they are happening in a jail right here in this city and i hope ms. norton will care about that as well as jails across the country. it's not just the january 6 defendant's pretrial by the way but it's many inmates living in these conditions. i think that's something that you and i can carry about. >> could you just yield for a minute? >> no, i will not. but i would like to say and point out civil rights and liberties are important but we have to make sure that we crackdown on the justice system
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because that needs to end and i will now yield back theus remainder of my time. >> any further? >> the question is on the amendment. all those in favor say aye. all those opposed, no. in the opinion of the chair, the noes have it. >> recorded vote has been requested. roll call votes will be postponed and at the time announced in advance. >> the clerk will designate the amendment. >> amendment number seven to the rulest of the committee on oversight and accountability as offered by representative donald's. >> mr. donald'ss for five minutes. >> mr. chair man and to the members, but my role would do is what we have been doing under the discussion of the rules of the committee. for the freshman who were just here people watch committee is obviously my colleagues have
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been here a long time the process of the committees has cs been seniority recognition so the members typically come in by their seniority you have your five minutes, you are recognized and not all members but a lot of members leave at the end of their five minutes so when we have witnesses in the room what you witness is a situation where there is no dialogue between the members of congress there is a backck and forth with witnessesn the room and then there's no broadero discussion by the committee. my rule change would provide the ability for all members to be recognized through the chair so that the members at their discretion enough when they want to engage in dialogue would go through the chair you wouldn't be constrained to simply your five minutes. you would have an ability to engage in dialogue whether it's with of the witnesses directly or later in discussion that you want to come back around and speak to or to even have dialogue through witnesses with members on the other side ofbe e
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aisle. this rule change facilitates the debate in committees something that i found coming as a freshman we do very little of in committees. this rule change will help the committees to be more efficient in time because instead of being structured and five-minute blocks we have many staff members in the room where the staff right the commentary and it would give the ability to get to the point and sometimes instead of five minutes you only need to or may be one. the third thing you want to do is we have issues with government officials who have to come before the committee so this amendment will provide for the members that have the ability to engage with members before they have to leave because some of them only have two or three hours so that is
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the structure of the amendment. i would also add i am aware there are members on my s side f the aisle who have concerns about this amendment because we are in a process where we structure our days and time based upon when we come in and when we come out. to my colleague on the other side we know how that works in the state legislature where you schedule your committees so members can be where they need to bee better because this is something that is new to congress and i think this is something congress does need but also as a respected freshman, my hope is that we facilitate more debatete in the process becausen that oversight committee we will be touching many topicsl that ae going to require the debate of the members through witnesses instead of just speechifying to the witnesses for clips and reels and r all that fun stuff o
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been the essence of being supportive of the chair i want to make sure they are working effectively and efficiently and i'mm going to withdraw my amendments but i do think it is something of the members should think about not just in this congress but the evolution of congress in the years to come. i will yield back. >> if i may respond i will work with you on that and i would agree with what you're saying. we will make every accommodation possible to do exactly what you just said. >> any other member seek recognition on amendments? >> seeing then we are going to recess until 12:30 and then we will have those votes and try to get through this as quickly as possible. we want to be very efficient and respectful of your time. there will be ten minutes to gather everybody up for votes, or 11 minutes and then we will have outside promptly 10:30. the committee is now in recess.
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>> in order to take up the postponed recorded votes, a recorded vote has been requested for the clerk will call the role. [roll call] [roll call]
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[roll call] [roll call]
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[roll call] >> are there any other members that haven't recorded votes? >> mr. chair man, how am i recorded? >> he is not recorded. >> i vote no.
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>> will the clerk reported that hallie? >> the vote is 23 in favor, 19 opposed. >> i think that's wrong. >> my apologies. twenty-three noes and 19 yes. >> the amendment fails. a recorded vote has been requested for amendment number two. the clerk will call the role. [roll call]
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[roll call] [roll call] >> are there any other members that seek to be recognized to
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vote? if not, the clerk will report the tally. twenty-three noes and 19 yeses. the amendment fails. a recorded vote has been requestede for the lynch amendment. the clerk will call the role. [roll call] [roll call]
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>> how has mr. burchett been recorded? >> he's not recorded. >> mr. burchett votes no. >> has any other member not been recognized for those? >> the clerk will report the tally. >> 23 noes and 19 yes. >> the amendment fails. the recorded vote has been requested for the amendment and
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the clerk will call the role. [roll call] [roll call] [roll call]
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[roll call] ..
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>> 24 know, 19 yes. >> the amendment fails. the recorded vote has been requested for the reporter amendment the clerk will call the roll. [roll call]
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[roll call] does any other member seek recognition to vote? seeing none the clerk will report the tally 24 know. nineteen yes.
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>> the porter amendment fails. we recorded vote has been requested for the amendment and the clerk will call the roll. [roll call] [roll call]
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[roll call]
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>> any other members not been recorded? please report the tally. >> 24 know 19 yes. >> the crockett amendment fails since me have concluded the votes on the amendments i felt that proposed rules be adopted as the committee for oversight and accountability for the 118th congress. all those in favor?
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all those opposed? in theo. opinion of the chair the proposed rules are adopted. >> i like to seek a recorded vote. >> a recorded vote has been requested will the clerk please call the roll. [roll call]
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[roll call] [roll call]
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>> does any member need to vote? will the clerk please report the tally? >> 24 yes, 19 no. >> the rules are adopted and ewithout objection to motion to reconsider is laid upon the table. pursuant to house rules ofle the rules adopted by the house oversight and accountability forr the 118th congress will be published made available on the committee's website. before we conclude the organizational meeting and went to yield to ranking member raskin's for closing remarks.
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>> i just briefly want to return at the start of the meeting that staff has been h working hard with a bipartisan agreement how we will handle certain issues such asbl maintaining whistleblower protections, community records committing to not investigating eachmm other stafr , security clearance policy and other such items based on c president intended to facilitate bipartisan cooperation and transparency and fairness of the committee can conduct its mission as efficiently and effectively as in as united way possible. hope we can continue productive conversations and appreciate your consideration in this regard. i yield back. >> i love that you found willingness for bipartisanship and we will get along just fine. this concludes today's organizational meeting and without objection staff can make technical and conforming changes to reflect the actions of the committee. without objection the o committee stands adjourned.
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[inaudible conversations]
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